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From: edwards@bgsuvax.UUCP (Bruce Edwards)
Newsgroups: talk.bizarre,misc.legal,talk.politics.misc,talk.origins,sci.bio
Subject: Re: Are Animals Patentable?
Message-ID: <2087@bgsuvax.UUCP>
Date: 7 May 88 18:26:55 GMT
References: <97500013@prism> <4872@xanth.cs.odu.edu> <9915@tekecs.TEK.COM> <564@pedsga.UUCP>
Distribution: na
Organization: Bowling Green State University B.G., Oh.
Lines: 90
Keywords: chromosomes chimpanzee privet hedge
In article <564@pedsga.UUCP>, lae@pedsga.UUCP writes:
> In article <2924@saturn.ucsc.edu> kevin@chromo.UUCP writes:
>
> Someone correct if I'm wrong, but I believe that humans have
> 46 chromosomes, vs. 48 in the chimpanzee. This may provide
> insurmountable problems as far as interbreeding, though some
> die-hards may continue to try. :-P
And why aren't more people trying. It seems to me if you are
consistent with an evolutionary model it might be the most
compassionate thing to do for our 'little cousins'. It could
help bring their whole species along to the exalted position
man had to attain to by 'chance and time'. Here we are trying
deparately to produce fruit flies with 4 wings and we could
be givin' these poor little guys the chance to enjoy Mozart
tisk, tisk.
Consider the following from The Dragon's of Eden by Carl Sagan;
[he recounts a visit to a large research facility]
"I was powerfully reminded of those American motion pictures
of the 1930' and 40's, set in some vast and dehumanizing state
or federal penitentiary [I don't know why he has to go back that
far KJ] in which the prisoners banged their eating utensils against
the bars at the appearance of the tyrannical warden......But
chimpanzees can abstract. Like other animals they are capable of
strong emotions....Why, exactly, all over the civilized world,
in virtually every major city, are apes in prison?
For we all know, occasional viable crosses between humans and
chimpanzees are possible. The natural experiment must have been
tried very infrequently, at least recently. If such offspring
are ever produced, what will their legal status be?"
The Dragons of Eden, by Carl Sagan
Ballantine Books : New York 1977 p127,128
The Scripture prohibits beastiality [Lev. 20:15,16, also 18:23, Exo. 22:19,
Deu. 27:21]. Let me suggest however that the prohibition is not related
to the sexual aspect primarily, nor are the prohibitions against incest.
Most people find beastiality repulsive because of health reasons (although
it seems to me that could be remedied) or because they have been 'in-
doctrinated' with these Judeo-Christians prohibitions (in which case if you
disgard these as 'unsophisticated' or whatever, the second barrier is
effectively removed and they way is open to do some real evolutionary
'good' for our backward relatives).
Now you might say this is ridiculous no one's going to go out and 'get
it on with chimps' we could just do some gene tinkering, testtube
fertilization, and DNA 'monkey business' (forgive me ;-). To that I
say don't forget Carl's concern about the chimp's emotional needs.
At what point, saying the gene tinkering works, would the chimps be
sufficiently 'human' to allow for meaningful sex (assuming you accept
the concept).
The reason I believe Biblical prohibition against beastiality is related not
to sex primarily but to the crime of violating God's design ('kind-ness'
from GEN. 1). In other words had the techniques been available in O.T.
times to do genetic 'monkey business' I think there would have been
mention of it in Biblical law as well. Would it have prohibited the
hybridization of corn too? This is a good question? My opinion is ,no
(although you may wish to challenge me on my consistency at this point).
The 'violation of divine design' is also an important aspect of the
prohibition against homosexuality and the anti-Gay stance of Christians.
You may say, "some Christians think homosexuality is acceptable." My
response would be 'some Jews don't believe in God', my challenge is
'support the position'.
> I also read somewhere that the only known species on the planet
> sharing the human characteristic of having 46 chromosomes is...
> the privet hedge. Kind of makes sense, doesn't it?
Above applies to privet hedges too. ;-)
> Leslie
Save the whales, Free the chimps!
Disclaimer: I am participating as a guest of Bruce Edwards. My name
is Ken Jenkins. Bruce is generally amused with my ramblings
but does not necessarily agree with them.
'These are only the shadowlands.' C.S. Lewis
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