Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site mit-eddie.UUCP Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!allegra!bellcore!decvax!genrad!mit-eddie!nessus From: nessus@mit-eddie.UUCP (Doug Alan) Newsgroups: net.music Subject: Re: Kate Bush's "The Dreaming", Peter Gabriel, & "The Kick Inside" Message-ID: <3610@mit-eddie.UUCP> Date: Sun, 10-Feb-85 17:28:04 EST Article-I.D.: mit-eddi.3610 Posted: Sun Feb 10 17:28:04 1985 Date-Received: Tue, 12-Feb-85 05:15:37 EST References:<19@unc.UUCP> Distribution: net.music Organization: MIT, Cambridge, MA Lines: 103 ["Space is what I need -- it's what I feed on."] >> [Me] No musician sits in his basement, totally isolated >> from the entire history of music, and creates >> masterpieces. > [sherouse@unc.UUCP (George W. Sherouse)] Ever hear of Neu? No. > How about their other half, Kraftwerk? And what about > Frippertronics. Eno's Snake guitar. Music to be in the > basement by. Certainly not derivative. Fine. Kraftwerk, Frip, and Eno create masterpieces too. But they certainly haven't been isolated from the history of music. They use western instruments, western scales, and western rhythms in their music. They also combine this with their own inventions and other things. Why is it that if Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush decide to use non-western instruments and non-western rhythms (combined with their own inventions, western instruments and rhythms, etc.) they are suddenly derivative??? They aren't! Your argument is a pile of crap! >> If your accusations about Kate Bush and Peter Gabriel >> were true, we would expect to find pseudo-African >> rhythms on "The Dreaming", wouldn't we? But there >> aren't any African-sounding rhythms on it. > I didn't say African, I said third world. Pay attention. The > title "The Dreaming", the concept of the title song, and most > certainly the rhythm and instrumentation are closely coupled > with the aborigines of the land downunder. Also check the > phrasing. No little British girl is going to sing God Save The > Queen like Kate sings > "Bang-a-goes-a-nuth-a-kang-a-on-a-bon-it-uh-the-van". But you said that Kate Bush was derivative of Peter Gabriel. Peter Gabriel uses some African rhythms in his music. Perhaps some American Indian too. But no Aborigine. If Kate Bush was merely derivative of Peter Gabriel, there would be no way for her to get Aborigine instruments and rhythms in her music. Also, since the song "The Dreaming" is about the rape and destruction of Aborigine culture, it seems perfectly reasonable to use some Aborigine instruments in the song, and to sing the saracastic voice with an Australian accent. Not only that, but your basing your whole rediculous argument on one song? There is only ONE song on "The Dreaming" inspired by third world music. There is one other song inspired by ethnic music, "Night of the Swallow", which has a strong Irish influence. That's two songs out of ten. Hardly excessive! > Give me a break. Ditto. >> ..."The Dreaming" is probably significantly different >> than her other albums, because Kate produced "The >> Dreaming", giving her complete artistic control over it. >> "The Kick Inside" was produced by someone who was much >> more conscious about commercial success. > Some are meant to lead and others to be led. Some would have great artistic minds limited and constrained for the sake of a buck. ("Would you break even my wings, like a swallow.") >> The record company selected for the album the songs of >> her that were innocently sensous and lusty, knowing that >> they could make loads of money off of the sex-appeal of >> an innocent/naughty 15-17 year old girl. > Worked, too. Did anybody else catch her "Rolling the Ball" on SNL? It was certainly a commercially wise decision. I'm sure they made plenty of money. But is that the point of art? No! > What I was trying to say, and I stick by it, is that Kate's work > was significantly more robust when she was experimenting less. > She is a very talented vocalist and lyricist. She should stick > with what she knows. Leave the experimenting to the > professionals. Well foo! "The Dreaming" is an order of magnitude better than any of her previous albums. Now that she has the freedom to experiment and expand herself artistically, her true genius glows unobstructed by commercial clutter. She is a very talented vocalist and lyricist and that talent would be wasted on anything less ambitious than what she has been doing recently. No one should let themselves get stuck in a rut. Leave the experimenting to the true artists, like Kate Bush. So there! "Narrow mind would persecute it, Die a little to get to it." Doug Alan mit-eddie!nessus Nessus@MIT-MC P.S. I don't see anything exceptionally innovative about the album "Everything but the Girl", though I wouldn't argue with the term "competent".