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From: aeq@pucc-h (The Blackguard of the West)
Newsgroups: net.religion.christian
Subject: Re: fornication and Christianity (lengthy uplifting digression)
Message-ID: <1825@pucc-h>
Date: Wed, 13-Feb-85 00:40:38 EST
Article-I.D.: pucc-h.1825
Posted: Wed Feb 13 00:40:38 1985
Date-Received: Wed, 13-Feb-85 04:25:19 EST
References: <488@pyuxd.UUCP>
Organization: Cordes Junction
Lines: 105

From Dinsdale Piranha (pyuxd!rlr):

>> Can fornication be beneficial?  yes.  Can it be harmful?  yes.  Who does it
>> serve?  I think it mostly serves the individuals.  Engaging in fornication
>> for the wrong reasons *can* serve the devil, but abstaining for the wrong
>> reasons can also.  I suspect it depends on the individual, abstinence
>> being right for some people, and fornication being right for others.
>> Paul also said he thought it was better to remain single, but I see an
>> awful lot of devout Christians getting married.  [Seifert]

> This is the biggest single problem I see with dogmatic rule-oriented religion.
> A very good point is made here:  some things are right for some people, and
> not right for others.  Other things may be right for those other people, but
> not necessarily for (still) others.  A whole lot of things were right (and
> wrong) for Paul.  Does the fact that his book sold millions of copies make
> them right for everyone?  Why is poor Jeff Sargent trying to squeeze certain
> things into his life that may be hopelessly inappropriate for him, just
> because it says so in a book?  [Rosen]

Apparently either you have not read either my postings or my letters to
you, or else you have filtered them through your negative preconceptions --
contrary to your claimed intention to see all things objectively.  You will
note that my recent writings talk a lot about FREEDOM in Christ; perhaps you
are slow to adjust to the fact that Christ can change people quickly if they
let Him.  I am finding, for instance, that I actually would prefer *not* to
fornicate, that I actually would *prefer* to keep sex in a context of full
trust and commitment -- not because of anything the Bible says, but because
that's what I really want.  (I admit that I'm not sure what I would do if a
woman with whom I had a really trusting relationship short of marriage wanted
to add a sexual dimension to it; this depends on so many factors that it's
useless to speculate.)

> Uniform monolithic rules for everyone not only stagnate the human race by
> making everyone the same (or close to it), but they also deteriorate the
> quality of each individual life.  Desiring a world in which everyone obeys
> such rules of behavior (beyond simple non-interference laws) is the same as
> desiring to see the world force-fit into your mold, and desiring to lay down
> what others can and cannot do.

It is true that many people who claim to be presenting Christianity actually
present various flavors of religion with strict rules (or at least a generally
legalistic attitude).  However, I have finally begun recently to understand and
experience for myself the truth that I have encountered here and there in
Christian writings:  that freedom means being free to do what you were designed
to do = what God wants you to do = what you, in your heart of hearts, really
want to do.  God made you and loves you, and "His commands are not burdensome";
and it would be illogical on His part, as well as unloving, for Him to make you
so that your truest desire was at variance with what He wanted for you, since
then you would be always in a suboptimal state -- you would either be doing
His will, which was not what you really wanted, or you would be doing what you
really wanted, but uncomfortable because it was not His best for you.  He gives
us the opportunity of both satisfying our deepest desires and being in close
fellowship with Him; indeed, the first follows from the second, since it has
taken me years of prayer to come to this realization myself.

This may be getting a bit confusing.  Let me clarify:  What the Bible says
is true, that as one becomes a slave to Christ, he actually becomes truly
free.  As I have gone on for years, opening up to Him my hatred, anger, envy,
fears/defense mechanisms, desires (even the ones that seemed innocent), I have
been freed of quite a bit of stuff that interferes with my happiness and joy
and my ability to give love to those around me.  I've certainly got a long
way to go; I have the habits of almost 30 years of hating to reverse -- but,
seeing that now, I can choose to do so (or not to! -- this is real freedom
we're talking here).  I will continue to open my feelings, thoughts, desires,
etc. to God; things are just starting to get interesting, as some first hints
of genuine goodness start to show up in me.  It's exciting; I'm curious and
hopeful as to where I'll end up.  God will continue to show me how I can
most fully live my life (John 10:10), if I choose to see it, and to give me
power, if I choose choose to receive it, to cast aside all that hinders me
from having the full and creative and loving life He and I hope and want
for me to live.

However, one point that has been made is that God is not likely to give
someone a special revelation on a point that has already been made in the
Bible.  But the Bible is *not* intended as a set of rules to be imposed on
people from without; rather it provides guidelines, hints if you will, as
to what you would discover to be the optimal way of life if you worked at
it long enough and gave it a chance, as I am beginning to do.  Since not
everyone has made these discoveries (though they can make a lot of them by
observing the effects of other lifestyles on those who follow them), it
is still wise for people to apply these rules (they will feel like rules)
to themselves -- not to obey based on fear of eternal punishment or temporal
ostracism, but to decide that these are the best way, and believe that God
will show them so in more detail later on.  While it is true that all are
individuals, all are also humans, and thus have some things in common.  The
Bible presents indications of both the commonalities (the basic functioning
of all humans) and the differences (mention is made in several places of
different gifts, and of all the diverse parts which constitute the Body of
Christ), with neither of them considered unimportant.

Put it this way:  If the Bible is (mis)used as a book of laws -- especially
if it is used to support the control of most people by a few "religious"
leaders who have taken the power onto themselves -- then it will indeed
lead either to a society of people who are all alike, or to a society of
very discontented and rebellious people (actually, probably a mixture).
But if individuals freely choose to use the Bible, intimacy with God, and
the counsel of others in the faith (including those older and wiser who
are leaders, but not theocrats), to help them mold their own lives, there
will be certain similarities among all of them, but they will be most free
to be fully the glorious and beautiful individuals they were created to be.

-- 
-- Jeff Sargent
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"Head him off at the pass!"  (advice by a mother to her daughter)