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Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!ulysses!unc!mcnc!decvax!tektronix!orca!shark!hutch
From: hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison)
Newsgroups: net.religion.christian
Subject: Re: fornication and Christianity
Message-ID: <1247@shark.UUCP>
Date: Sun, 10-Feb-85 19:23:43 EST
Article-I.D.: shark.1247
Posted: Sun Feb 10 19:23:43 1985
Date-Received: Mon, 11-Feb-85 07:55:56 EST
References: <428@pyuxd.UUCP> <1777@pucc-h> <457@pyuxd.UUCP>
Reply-To: hutch@shark.UUCP (Stephen Hutchison)
Organization: Tektronix, Wilsonville OR
Lines: 74
Summary: 

In article <457@pyuxd.UUCP> rlr@pyuxd.UUCP (Fred Mertz) writes:
>> From Pesmard Flurrmn (pyuxd!rlr) [what's he doing in this group, anyway?
>> This is where we all went to avoid him]:  [SARGENT]
>
>So nice of you to admit it, Jeff.  (To avoid what, one might ask...)  Also so
>nice to bring my name up every so often (Brown, Marchionni) in my "absence".

One might indeed ask.  This newsgroup was created to provide a forum in which
we Christians could discuss issues relevant to Christianity without the
continual carping and the same old tired, boring, and half-baked presumptions
about our intellect, background, and reasoning powers which YOU, RICH ROSEN,
continually spew out upon us.  When net.religion.jewish was created it was
created to provide a similar forum for Jews to discuss their common religious
and cultural heritage.

Of the approximately 20 articles which you have put out to this forum,
maybe three or four (generously speaking) have been polite, not presuming that
we were all a bunch of loonies for the Enlightened Rosen to administer the
balm of his superior wisdom upon.  Well, Rich, the three or four articles
were welcome.  The rest of your postings have been less than worthless.


>>>Why MUST everything we do be be "beneficial"?  "Constructive?"  Isn't life
>>>full of things that are neither (though not antipodal to either)?  Don't many
>>>of those things heighten the overall experience of life?  [ROSEN]
>
>> Can you name any examples of non-beneficial, non-constructive things that
>> enhance life?  The opposite of constructive is DESTRUCTIVE, and I am trying
>> to get away from that. [SARGENT]
>
>Thus, all things in the universe are either one way (A) or the exact opposite
>(not-A), and of course there's nothing in between and no neutral ground and
>no exceptions.  Examples of things that are "neither" abound (sorry, Greg
>Skinner), and in fact these very things are often the basis of discussion
>(i.e., often violent argument) between the religious and the non-religious.
>For example, homosexuality.  Is it CON-structive?  Is it DE-structive?
>There are numerous other examples, among them:  open sexual relationships
>outside of marriage, individualism in sex/family roles (actually, this is
>quite constructive!), and, last but not least, NOT devoting all of one's life
>to god.

To provide an honest answer to the best of my beliefs, even though you
haven't phrased this as a question... We can identify things which are
directly and inherently constructive.  These are those things which we
are instructed to do (Love the Lord, love our neighbors, help the helpless,
feed the hungry, etc.)

We can identify as inherently DEstructive anything which works against
those aims.  For example, it is hard to love our neigbors when we are
engaged in gossip against them.  Incidentally, a lot of the Law consists
in identifying these destructive things.

Anything else which is neutral becomes subject to situational ethics.
Yes, I advocate situational ethics, under constraint.  Is it good to
feed the hungry?  Yes, but if I give money to a street drunk, he will
most likely spend it on more booze not on food, and food is what he
needs.  Is it good to participate in sports?  Well, yes, if the sport
doesn't cause you to hate your neighbor (or incite others to hate their
neighbors) and no, if you come to place that sport in control of your
entire life (the Lord is supposed to be in control of that.)

One is devoting ALL of one's life to the Lord when one makes certain that
all one's activities are in harmony with His intentions for that life.
How can you tell?  Prayer, careful study of scripture, and considered and
careful thought and planning.  This is not the same as that mindless
drooling obedience to the dictum of some charismatic preacher which
many non-Christians seem to think is the standard Christian mindset.

Hutch  (the opinions I give above, except for the quotes, are my own,
	formulated with at least as much thought and care as I could
	give them, and influenced by study of Christian scripture and
	study of the beliefs and thoughts of others, both Christian
	and non-Christian.  They do not constitute the ONLY Christian
	view.)