Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site qubix.UUCP Path: utzoo!linus!decvax!decwrl!sun!qubix!steven From: steven@qubix.UUCP (Steven Maurer) Newsgroups: net.singles Subject: Re: Majority/Minority Stereotypes - Rebuttal Message-ID: <1330@qubix.UUCP> Date: Sun, 19-Aug-84 05:55:56 EDT Article-I.D.: qubix.1330 Posted: Sun Aug 19 05:55:56 1984 Date-Received: Tue, 21-Aug-84 04:29:57 EDT References: <3308@decwrl.UUCP> <2699@allegra.UUCP>, <984@pyuxn.UUCP> Organization: Qubix Graphic Systems, Saratoga, CA Lines: 90 [**] >> No, I see your point, Alan and Steve. All stereotypes are the same, >> heinous evil entities, whether there are people who fit them or not. >> Thus, if you're dealing with the bigoted stereotype of a black person >> (choose your own "favorite" distasteful imagery) with which he/she has >> been labelled unfairly, that's exactly the same as a stereotype >> CONSCIOUSLY ADHERED TO by millions of American males (because they >> think they're "supposed to" or for whatever reason). Both are to be >> avoided and ignored (even though millions fall into definition #3 of >> stereotype regarding the latter case). Thank you for clearing that up. >> [NOTE: THE ENTIRE PREVIOUS PARAGRAPH WAS INTENDED AS SARCASM.] Yes, of course Mr Rosen, being one of the "Majority" I now see that all the "Majority Stereotypes" about people like me are really *completely* legitimate, because I "CONSCIOUSLY ADHERE" to them. Yes, Indeed. Every day, when I get up to go to work, I look in the mirror and say to myself, "Steve, you're going to be an insensitive asshole today". I have to keep cue cards to remember all the latest racist epithets, since all us white males are bigots, don't you know. Oh yes, every time I go out on a date, I have to figure out whether it's paw and slobber, or slobber and paw, -- I can never quite remember -- (though I occasionally take lessons)... certainly I would never let a whimpy thing like love and caring into any serious relationship. On the other hand, the poor "Minority" peoples around this country suffering under the burden of "Minority Stereotypes", who have all been "labeled unfairly", since it is obvious that no stereotype typifies even a *single* member of that minority. No indeed, never have I ever seen any black man interested in the game of basketball -- *every single one* was studying far too hard in high school to be interested in sports. No sir, thanks to you, I now see that it all was just a vicious rumor, started by a few (unnamed) people to spread "Lies and Hatred", and has not a single twisted grain of truth in it at all. Yes, now I understand that stereotypes are perfectly reasonable ways to make preconceptions about "Majority" people (as long as you carefully steer away from any "Minority" ones). Luckily this should be easy to tell, since only people who are spreading "Lies and Hatred" believe in "Minority" stereotypes. Perhaps we might even replace the scientific method with your new discovery, Rich. ========== Seriously Rich, do you *really* believe that men in America put "Real Men don't eat Quiche" along side the bible, as a prime guide to social behavior?? ===>>> Do *you* do so???? <<<=== Remember that whenever constructing grand sweeping statements about people, you cannot exclude yourself from that statement. When I say "People are X", I am also saying "I am X", since I am a person. When you say "Men are X", you also are saying "I am X", if you are a Man. You are immediately given evidence to the contrary, if you don't measure up to your own hypothesis. You can't section yourself off either, since TRUE statements take into account all possibilities ("Apples are Green -- well some are" vs "Ripe apples are green, yellow, or red"). As far as Stereotypes go, it is obvious that they are *not* correct all of the time, and yet are correct about some percentage of the group which the stereotype concerns. Now for mathematicians this is ok, since they understand that a statement, TRUE only on random occasions, is meaningless, but for the rest of us -- especially when you realise that people pre-judge based on these statements -- they are very harmful. Yes indeed, I *DO* believe that: "All stereotypes are the same, heinous evil entities, whether there are people who fit them or not.". Indeed, if there was absolutely no one who fit a proposed stereotype ("All men are pickels") I wouldn't feel offended at all. >> "bigotry requires two elements: hatred and lies. Neither one was >> present in this case." You are forgetting the *real* basis for bigotry: fear and ignorance. Fear, ignorance, or stupidity (i.e. unwillingness to examine evidence to the contrary). -------------------------- Steven Maurer decwrl!qubix!steven Maurer's Observations on human intelligence: 1] People are incredibly stupid. 2] People are smarter than you think.