Relay-Version: version B 2.10 5/3/83; site utzoo.UUCP Posting-Version: version B 2.10.1 6/24/83; site pucc-h Path: utzoo!watmath!clyde!burl!mgnetp!ihnp4!inuxc!pur-ee!CS-Mordred!Pucc-H:aeq From: aeq@pucc-h (Jeff Sargent) Newsgroups: net.religion Subject: Re: two of Kulawiec's Message-ID: <940@pucc-h> Date: Tue, 14-Aug-84 21:32:35 EDT Article-I.D.: pucc-h.940 Posted: Tue Aug 14 21:32:35 1984 Date-Received: Thu, 16-Aug-84 01:19:19 EDT References: <45700017@convex.UUCP>, <937@pucc-h>, <936@pucc-h> Organization: Tucumcari Divinity School Lines: 47 > It's about time that those who claim deific justification > for their cruel words and actions, and their blindness, realized > just whose company they're in. (the company referred to being Torquemada et al.) This one I can reservedly agree with, though I doubt that the motivations for all people who come across as cruel with a religious coloring are the same; e.g. some did it continually for years (the Inquisitors), while others do it sporadically (myself). I do it at times when I'm feeling generally rotten and confused about my relationship to God and unsure what He has in mind for me; at such times I may seize onto the false security of considering myself better than others and heaping contempt onto those others. Now, I'm not sure why the inquisitors of old, and the Moral Majoritarians of today, come on so strong all the time; I don't know about the Inquisitors, since I'm not living in Spain centuries ago; I have a hypothesis that the MM'ers are indeed looking for security in the wrong place -- temporal power and a predictable world. Alas, the New Testament indicates that this is not at all the way to security. If one looks to the Lord for security, one is enabled to take what look like ridiculous risks, as the early disciples did, knowing that one is never ultimately rejected; in other words, one is enabled to be really alive. (I admit that I rarely manage to pull this off in my own life; but now and then there are moments of joy and glory; I hope to see these increased.) > let me tell you something: if the god you > speak of comes back, I for one will start looking for sturdy trees > and good rope again; he's got a lot to answer for. Presumably this was in response to the article on "O My God", by The Police, in which someone stated that if God prevented all suffering, that would obviate the free will of humans (not to mention angelic and demonic beings). But why blame God for allowing free will? Rather, blame Satan and the other demons, not to mention multitudes of uncaring, self-centered humans (I can say this, since I'm one of them), whose sins of commission and/or omission -- i.e. whose abuse of their free will -- are responsible for the suffering. Anyway, why waste time fixing blame? If there is suffering you don't like to see, you can always do something about it. God often prefers to use people to help other people for the benefit of both the helped (obviously) and the helpers, since it gives the helpers an opportunity to develop the loving, giving, generous character which is so strongly advocated in the New Testament, especially in Jesus's sermons. -- -- Jeff Sargent {decvax|harpo|ihnp4|inuxc|seismo|ucbvax}!pur-ee!pucc-h:aeq "We can build a beautiful city, yes we can, yes we can...."