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From: owens@gatech.UUCP (Gerald R. Owens)
Newsgroups: net.abortion
Subject: Re: Another look (venn diagrams)
Message-ID: <9470@gatech.UUCP>
Date: Sat, 4-Aug-84 12:08:46 EDT
Article-I.D.: gatech.9470
Posted: Sat Aug  4 12:08:46 1984
Date-Received: Mon, 6-Aug-84 03:24:06 EDT
References: <494@rayssd.UUCP>
Organization: Georgia Tech School of ICS, Atlanta
Lines: 47

	Thank you for the venn diagram, melissa.  It pointed out a
distinction that I want to make.  The problem with the fetus is that
it is put into the set of "living things legal to kill" now, but if
given enough time, suddenly hops (with a maddening volition of it's own,
it seems :-) into the set of humans (or "living things not legal to kill").
It is the only entity that, at different times of it's life, has
occupied both sets.  Ok.  WHEN does it make the transition?  (oh no!
here's the old "where do you draw the line" argument.  It's fair to ask
here, however, for the definition of the sets requires that the question
be asked).  If it does not make the transition, then it behaves like the
magic problem that is being sought to prove that P=NP, for feti become
babies, who become adolescents, who become adults, who contribute
articles to this newsgroup.  If it NEVER transitions out of the "legal
to kill" group, then "legal to kill"="not legal to kill", which is EXACTLY
what we pro-life people have been worried about.  Two solutions exist:

	1.	The fetus was never in the "legal to kill" group at all.
		However, this brings up the question of how two entities,
		in the "legal to kill" group could combine to create
		an entity that hops the group boundaries into the
		"not legal to kill" group.  A good question that I haven't
		gotten a decent answer for yet.

	2.      The fetus IS in the "legal to kill" group, but gains
		properties that shifts it into the "not legal to kill"
		group.  Quite plausible, since the argument for the
		death penalty is that the beings being executed have
		committed certain acts that shifted them out of the
		"legal to kill" group.  Could also be an answer to
		the question raised in solution #1.  However, we pro-life
		people would like to have those properties enumerated
		and put into law, otherwise some nut with a toothbrush
		moustache might start shifting a lot of members from
		the "not legal to kill" group into the "legal to kill"
		group for some asinine reasons.  Some might argue
		that preservation of health, life, property, reputation,
		convenience of SOMEBODY ELSE is sufficient reason to
		kill the fetus. (Why the same reasons do not apply to
		criminals rubbing out the witnesses against them is a bit
		unclear to me, however).

	Jeepers.  That Venn diagram REALLY cleared things up for me!
Thanks again, melissa.

					Gerald Owens

					Owens@Gatech